The Campaign For DA

9.01.2017

This Should Horrify You

By all accounts, the head nurse at the University of Utah Hospital’s burn unit was professional and restrained when she told a Salt Lake City police detective he wasn’t allowed to draw blood from a badly injured patient.

The detective didn’t have a warrant, first off. And the patient wasn’t conscious, so he couldn’t give consent. Without that, the detective was barred from collecting blood samples — not just by hospital policy, but by basic constitutional law.


And you guys wonder why I chose to do the job I'm doing. Bad cops, which are few and far between, will always get exposed so long as there is someone to grade their papers. Video is helping that cause. If he isn't fired by dawn, something is wrong.

38 comments:

Anonymous said...

Since the cop apparently did not have a warrant, I agree that any blood draw was not legally permitted by law. However, I believe the nurse's job is to tell LEOs that a blood draw is not allowed by law or hospital policy and call her supervisors and hospital administrators to intervene by instructing that the blood draw was not permitted by law. If there's any later criminal prosecution related to the blood draw, the results would be suppressed under the law.

If she physically obstructed the LEOs ability to draw blood, I think that's a little problematic on her part. I don't think the "scene" is the appropriate place to discuss legalities. Whether cops lie about speeding tickets or stop signs, stop a car with no probable cause, or take blood without consent or a warrant, the appropriate place to discuss the legalities of them all is in the courtroom. I tend to believe that it's not the nurse's job to physically keep the police away from the patient/suspect in an effort to "protect" him/her, if that's what happened here.

I'm not saying the cop is right; only that a physical confrontation at a scene to discuss the propriety of police actions is definitely not right. Plus, how often has anyone seen a police officer hell-bent on doing something - legal or not - back down?

Anonymous said...

The patient in question was the victim of this police chase, when the fleeing suspect, apparently deliberately, crashed head-on into his semi. Why would a cop want a blood sample from that guy anyway? Did he intend to frame him with a DUI in order to make his department look better after the horrible consequences of that chase?

Heroes. Every one of them.

Harry Hamid said...

Police state tactics. She's a hero.

Anonymous said...

That video disturbed me. The cop looks to be in his 60's, so more training isn't the answer.

Anonymous said...

Shaun King is a fraud.

Anonymous said...

To hell with his job. He needs to be put in jail

Anonymous said...

Sorry 8:01, I have to disagree with your viewpoint.

1. Yes, a LEO normally deserves respect and his directives followed to maintain public safety and expedite an investigation. This situation was so far out of bounds, none of that applies. Sorting it out administratively later to correct errors is non-nonsensical. This attitude is what has the folks arrested in the Waco biker melee in a pinch now. All were swept up, arrested, and charged. Eventually, the police and the DA say the innocent will be eliminated. Meanwhile, jobs have been lost, homes foreclosed, marriages fractured, etc, because of this attitude that anything a LEO does (right or wrong) cannot be called into question at the beginning, so slap everybody in jail. That's just not right, nor constitutional. Luckily, the nurse was released after twenty minutes, but was man-handled first.
2. The detective is captured on video talking with a colleague stating that he is put-out with having to wait and there will be ramifications for the hospital for not immediately caving on his demands. He also is a part-time ambulance driver and intends to deliver only the indigent to the ER door of that institution in the future. Patients with insurance or other financial means will be hauled to other facilities. Does any part of that statement bother you? It does me, big time.
3. Finally, the power of arrest as a strategy, not just an ultimate legal act. I had a sage old friend who trained young LEOs for many years. His experience was wide and varied and he was respected in the profession. He said more than once that some of his contemporary trainers taught officers-to-be that arrest was a good way to gain leverage and control an innocent who was not complying, or failing to give over what was wanted. Later, charges could be dropped and the innocent civilian released. But a message would have been sent that the officer could do anything he/she wanted to do at any time. Power run amok. My sage old friend taught his cadets that this attitude was wrong. He taught that arrest itself was an ultimate legal act and carried damaging consequences, even if an innocent was later released. He taught that a professional LEO was part of the legal process, not the Alpha & Omega of the process. That the Law, which all should respect, hold in high regard, and strive to follow, applied to all equally: judge, officer, DA, leading citizen, or bum in the gutter. He taught that it isn't MY law, it's OUR law. An amazing guy who trained a lot of good officers across North Texas.

The nurse is a hero. The detective and his duty officer, after due process and an investigation into what we all saw on the film should be fired. The nurse and hospital should sue the department and the city for being so lax that law enforcement personnel appeared ignorant of changes in the law that occurred over ten years ago. Finally, the chief should have an extensive performance review for building a department staff riddled with rot and lack of professionalism, again as evidenced by the video.

Sorry, for the rant, but this goes to our basic rights as Americans. We should all be outraged.

DF James Madison
df My Best Quote: Liberty may be endangered by the abuse of liberty, but also by the abuse of power.

Anonymous said...

801- RNs are legally empowered to protect their patients. The state of Texas has very strong laws backing RNs in various scenarios that you are apparently not aware of.

Anonymous said...

Barry if you think that jackass will get fired you are very naive brother.

Anonymous said...

That POS should have had his testicles relocated up into the vicinity of his threat by te big hospital security guy while they were on the stoop, disarmed, and handcuffed, while awaiting the internal affairs to show.
This kinda thing makes us close in proximity to Zimbabwe than Mayberry.

Not Sam

Anonymous said...

You're not a hero Barry. This isn't what you fight. Don't elevate yourself.

Anonymous said...

Skippy, Has Trump fired Sessions yet?

Anonymous said...

Some cops were just killed in California so you lefties should be happy.

As far as the nurse is concerned, I say lock her up!!!

Anonymous said...

2:52:

I guess the questions become: who gets to decide what is "so far out of bounds" and when does that get decided? Do you get to decide? Me? The nurse? The cop? If it's you, does that mean you get an auto pass to fight the cop (not saying that happened here, just hypo) because you think the cop's acting clearly wrong? Do you then get to automatically have an altercation with him at the scene where tensions are likely high and combustible?

I agree that the Waco situation is FUBAR and recognize that lives are affected by arrests. The Waco cops mostly didn't know who did what, and the DA can't figure it out either. However, in this case, it's not hard to figure out who did what (I personally do not know what nurse did in "protecting her patient" or "interfering with investigation" -- that's for someone else to decide).

I generally agree with you and your LEO trainer about arresting people. Except when there is truly probable cause to believe a crime is committed (not just some made-up arrest to get what cops want (usually obstructing justice or interfering with investigation charges). If a crime is actually committed - whether or not that's the ultimate act/suspect the cop cares about -- I think the cop can and should arrest, even if it's to gain leverage on another suspect who might be a worse criminal.

I think a review should be done on the cop's actions regarding the entire incident - not just what is depicted in the video - and discipline levied if warranted. I don't know this cop, and probably don't want to know him. But good or bad, the law generally confers on him a greater status than the rest of us (non-cops) regarding LE related activities on the street.

Re the nurse, would I want her to be my nurse if I'm in hospital, hell yes. But I still think she does not get an auto pass to physically confront - if she did - the cop to protect her patient.

I respect your opinion, just know it also creates more questions.

8:01

Anonymous said...

You might be right about RN powers to protect. But I'd bet that these "various scenarios" of protection don't involve "protection" from police. I might be wrong so I'd love you to point me to the specific Texas statutes so I can educate myself about RN protection powers.

Not mocking your comment, just want the support for your comment.

8:01

Anonymous said...

I think more of us are way more horrified of the prospect of being smashed by a drunk driver than being forcibly handcuffed and placed in a police car for an hour. And we both know which side of the law you are on when it comes to DWIs. Let's not pretend that you became some sort of community servant when you chose your line of work.

Anonymous said...

In Texas if a person is arrested for DWI and it involved an accident where anyone involved in the accident (including the suspect) has or will likely die you dont have to have a warrant to draw blood. Utah may have the same law or at least a similar one. That being said the Officer was still way out of line and should be punished. There is a right and a wrong way to handle things. That was not right at all.

Anonymous said...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaKjRMMU9HI

8:01 pm. Nazi Germany LOVED People like you :) And welcome to world according to Trump !!

Anonymous said...

Who do you trust more? Nurses or cops?

She can be my nurse anytime.

Anonymous said...

I don't like Trump or the cop's actions. I suspect the cop "trumped" up the charge because he didn't get what he wanted. I would hate to be in the nurse's position and commend her efforts to protect her patient.

Regardless, I find that people (often on this blog) who can't respond with reasonable arguments resort to name-calling (e.g., Nazi, racist, fascist, KKK). I'm ok with anyone, like 2:52, disagreeing with me, and I respect his/her position especially because he/she articulated it well. 12:16, at least try to make a plausible responsive argument instead of resorting to name-calling. Otherwise, you just show your ass.

I don't know Wordkyle but now can empathize when he is subjected to name-calling and the sort.

8:01

Anonymous said...

You are right on this one. And I'm a passionate cop defender, but I'm not blind.

Anonymous said...

This police officer needs to be in jail - for 72 years without parole. Then, strip EVER other department officer of their pensions. Only when we Make it clear will these officers stop. In my opinion, most police officers are one step from breaking the law, the I'm god mentality.

Anonymous said...

Let's face it, the law is hard for lawyers, let alone doughnut cops who invent the law with the "I have a gun" mentality. If I could afford it,is work for you for free.

Anonymous said...

12:12 was drunk.

Anonymous said...

"And you guys wonder why I chose to do the job I do. Bad cops."

That's like saying some African Americans commit crime, so I hate them all. Makes no sense.

Anonymous said...

Nurse belongs in prison.

Anonymous said...

11:05 I suppose you are on the side of drunks and criminals...wonder how many nurses agree with you...perhaps the cop was shocked the nurse didn't agree with his tactics. The nurse deserves an apology and a huge settlement from the people who hired him...just for the criminal assault she endured, not to mention the embarrassment.

Anonymous said...

10:14

You win the poster dunce of the day.

Wear the hat well.

Anonymous said...

I'm thinking 12:12 just got off the crack pipe.

Michael Kenyon said...

“Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer's life if necessary.” Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306.

Anonymous said...

12:12

Hyperbole much? Get a grip.

Michael Kenyon said...

This blog needs a way to rate the comments. The idiot factor is too high!

Anonymous said...

Sorry, Skippy, I tried to get horrified, but it just didn't quite meet my threshold for terror. Yeah, the detective was wrong. From what I see, no one was injured or killed by his actions. He will face appropriate discipline, and the nurse will likely get a handsome cash award.

Oh, the humanity...meh.

Anonymous said...

Why do you jerks have to make everything political? Jerks!
That officer is charged with upholding the law, not making it up as he goes. Power-hungry ass!

Anonymous said...

Barry is one of the heroes. A super special person too.

Anonymous said...

You're citing 1890's Indiana case law as legal justification in Texas to fight a LEO's unlawful arrest? Just so you know, Texas law does not provide a defense to resist arrest even if the arrest is unlawful. Section 38.03 Penal Code. I'm thinking your 1890's Indiana case case does not prevail over current Texas statutes.

8:01

Anonymous said...

Maybe as scary as anything? That jerk knew he had on camera on him and simply did not care.

Regardless, as Barry has said many times things like this happen every day we just didn't know about it before

Anonymous said...

2:32

No logical rebuttal only name calling. Classy.